US Government Sets Up Online "App Store" 138
krapper writes "The Obama administration has unveiled a government 'app store' designed to push the federal bureaucracy into the era of cloud computing. The change means some federal employees will begin using services like YouTube, Gmail and WordPress, which store data on private internet servers instead of on those paid for with public money. The process will start small but will ramp up quickly, Vivek Kundra, the US chief information officer, said in a blog post on Tuesday. 'Our policies lag behind new trends, causing unnecessary restrictions on the use of new technology,' Kundra writes in the post on WhiteHouse.gov. 'We are dedicated to addressing these barriers and to improving the way government leverages new technology.' The app store is designed for federal employees doing official government business and is not intended for use by the public."
Cloud services (Score:5, Funny)
federal employees will begin using services like YouTube, Gmail and WordPress
Maybe this means Joe Wilson can troll 4chan instead.
White House looking to hire a web archivist (Score:2, Interesting)
Good luck with all of that.
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Maybe this means Joe Wilson can troll 4chan instead.
Welcome to slashdot, Mr President!
Re:Cloud services (Score:4, Insightful)
Go to the .gov app store, click on your fav. representative, and send them your issue and PayPal contribution.
Sounds much easier to me!!
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You can now just buy your congressional representative online, and not have to go through a lobbying firm.
The market for congressional representatives needs to be opened up more. If power is decentralised more to the states and local levels, the price of nationwide legislation would go up as it would require bribing a lot more politicians. However the price of an individual legislator would come down due to increased competition and lower effectiveness (in terms of national policy), making corruption more accessible to the average citizen.
Not that I'm seriously in favor of more corruption but that is part of
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He's got to be shitting himself now that people are finally starting to wake up to who and what ACORN is and how deeply in bed with them he is..
No. We'll just keep calling all opposition racists.
It doesn't matter what is said, if it is not pro-Obama it must be deeply rooted in racism.
To link this to the +4 grandparent post and make it on-topic: that is why they had to admonish (misspelled on purpose) Joe Wilson. I don't remember anyone being admonished last year for booing Bush while he was speaking in front of congress during the state of the union.
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No. We'll just keep calling all opposition racists.
You go girl - unleash those straw men.
And Gov2.0 considers Trusted Computing a key (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:And Gov2.0 considers Trusted Computing a key (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm not sure how a TPM can establish identity. Fundamentally, a TPM is a cryptographic token that can accept a key or a passphrase, and has the option to seal it and keep it sealed until the right boot code is passed through it. Other than that, it is fundamentally just a smart card fixed onto a computer's motherboard.
A TPM wouldn't be good for validating a user, who can be using that machine, a phone, a jaw harp, or a beer mug with an IP stack for access. A TPM can validate that the first part of an OS boot was not tampered with on a machine, as well as store some private keys that are usable only on that box. The advantage of this would be for this is ensuring that an attacker can't just replace the MBR with a keylogger, then later on, steal the laptop in a two phase black bag attack.
For a single sign on for users, the US government already has a large and well established system, the DoD's Common Access Card.
Fears of a national ID card aside, using a smart card for access can be a very good thing. No passwords can be sniffed, it is quite easy to use client certificates (the server doesn't have to care one whit if a client's key is on a card, in Firefox's key storage, or in a TPM), and allows shorter passwords to be used, because all it would take is 3-15 (usual default settings on smart cards) bad attempts, and the smart card will either block further attempts until reset, or permanently brick itself needing replacement. Phishing would be useless because all a phisher would get is "yay, this user has connected to your web server with a valid certificate". The main way a smart card can be compromised would be malware that would grab the user's PIN via a keylogger, then use the smart card (if inserted) to sign/decrypt stuff in the background.
Finally, a large number of security programs like TrueCrypt can use smart cards. I have on a laptop TC protected volumes for a VM that runs my Quicken. If someone steals the laptop and manages to get past BitLocker (RAM dump while the box is on), they would need to have the passphrase, the PIN from the eToken, and the eToken itself, to be able to mount that volume. A couple wrong guesses, the eToken zaps itself, so that gets rid of the brute forcing route in. (Of course, rubber hose crypto does work, but my biggest security scenario is silent theft of the laptop, not seizure and interrogation of the owner.)
Disclaimer: TPMs are double edged swords, and they can be used to enforce DRM stacks, but I consider them a good thing in general. Especially because by the TCG spec, they are to be shipped disabled and unowned, so software companies cannot assume every computer user has one and can use it for copy protection.
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Yes, but, from what I've seen...pretty much ONLY the DoD uses that system. And knowing how turf wars go with gov. agencies..I doubt they want to share that system.
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VA doesn't.
They're trying a homebrew card.....but....
Great! (Score:1, Informative)
What could possibly go wrong?
http://www.marketwatch.com/m/story/25fdbe85-c490-42a4-9fea-50984f155661/0 [marketwatch.com]
http://www.thestreet.com/story/10474750/1/obamas-it-guru-returns-to-work.html [thestreet.com]
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haha.. can you say - security breach?
i trust google more than i trust the lowest bidder for a government contract.
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Google, OpenID, and Wave Systems have very good names to protect. Any type of civilian PKI that mirrors the CAC-based one on the DoD side (assuming it is implemented securely using HSMs to protect root and subroot keys), will bring a lot of security, and lower the attack surface in general.
This doesn't mean things will be completely secure, but it means that the ante will be upped to either compromising endpoints smart cards are used (to get the PIN and silently log on with the card), compromising the PKI,
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How about completely opening the entire authentication systems up?
It's exceptionally difficult to build an entire end-to-end authentication system, and it's massively more complex if you have more than one vendor. This is stupid - there are plenty of open specifications in this area - but nonetheless true. Part of the problem is that there's so many different ways to put the bits together in a manner that will work, and there's no easy way to either bridge between them or understand which is best for a particular situation. Add in the fact that irritatingly much of the se
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PKI ... CAC ... DoD ... HSM ... PIN ... RSA
You use a lot of TLAs, you know that?
AEM Signed Into Law (Score:3, Funny)
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I used to work for a defense contractor and the problem wasn't that we were the lowest bidder, it was the technically illiterate contracts officer that cut something irrelevant from a previous contract and added it to our contract.
Then when we delivered the CDRLs, the customer would get mad because what we delivered wasn't what he wanted. We'd point out that we delivered what was asked for (and what we were legally bound to de
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Oh come on, you are being rediculous (Score:5, Informative)
The first link is about Obama staffer's former colleague being investigated for crime. I don't even know what or whose fault are you trying to imply with that.
The second link is about the said staffer having committed a crime before. He shoplifted as a lot younger man, over a decade (13 years, to be exact) ago. He pleaded guilty and paid the fine... The "once a thief, always a thief" doesn't really apply to stuff like that. I myself shoplifted a few times when I was a teenager. I can understand a young man getting the small rush of doing something wrong there, with immediate risk of getting caught... It doesn't even imply that 13 years later one would have tendency to become corrupted or something.
So, what could possibly go wrong?
I think this is a great idea, as long as the programs the government will use will encrypt the data properly before storing it outside their servers. (though even that won't be necessary. I'm sure they won't use gmail for "top secret documents ;) )
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I'm sure the military won't use outside servers for top secret stuff (too paranoid, thank god), but Josephine Yutz, who got appointed for the great work she did during Rep. Bullwinkles campaign, just might. We've seen a lot of dumb shites do stuff like that in the past when they should have known better.
And "Cloud Computing", (god, I hate buzzwords) is okay for short-term projects that aren't critical, but all it would take is a couple of DDOS attacks on an external (commercial) server, or even just a servi
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I'm sure the military won't use outside servers for top secret stuff
You would hope so, but that's probably not the case [google.com].
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Unless they take pictures of their own swimsuit parts. That makes them evil!
Swimsuit parts? Like straps and that mesh lining stuff?
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You can't weigh the risks of the new way without considering the problems with how things are done now. Having thousands of independently run servers doing more or less the same thing throughout a big enterprise has lots of problems. Hopefully this will centralize widely-useful services, thus saving money on servers and administration. More importantly, it will give smaller departm
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They put so much there, etc...that eventually, YouTube and other formerly private company services become "too large/important to fail"? So, then, the govt. takes them over and starts regulating and running the shows?
I mean...with what has happened to private entities so far (banks, auto manufacturers), I think it is a legitimate worry.
I think before they can use such resources, they need to pass some
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Former Washington, D.C., CTO Vivek Kundra, who was recently appointed Federal CIO, has not been implicated in the FBI's corruption investigation, which centers on a city employee and a technology consultant.
This is an outrage. We can't have people who've not been implicated serving in government.
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So far I haven't seen anything to suggest that the principle is wrong.
Only because your system is designed to fail. Money as speech, resulting in legalized bribary (aka, lobbying)? Yeah, big surprise that that's lead to corporate ownership of the system.
If people in the US *actually* cared about running a system resistant to corruption, they'd a) demand the creation of an independent body to run and monitor elections (see Elections Canada for an example), b) make said body responsible for auditing the fin
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So once the gov't depends on these companies... (Score:5, Insightful)
...they'll be too important to fail?
The Term 'App Store' is Becoming Over Used (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:The Term 'App Store' is Becoming Over Used (Score:5, Insightful)
Agreed. This seems to be more of an official non-classified download repository than anything else. If I were in a small business and called their samba share that had the install images of Office, Acrobat, and other licensed packages for internal use an "app store", I'd be looked at by their IT people like I was some troll or pirate.
To me, a true "app store" is something like Apple's offering, Handango, Digital River, or a place where one looks through a catalog and either downloads a demo, or pays a license fee, then gets an executable to download.
There are some things I'd like to see the USG do though, if they are offering a large repository like this for internal use. The first thing is to PGP or gpg sign everything on the store so if it gets tampered with, one can find the app that has no or an invalid signature. (I'd also like to see Authenticode signing on Windows installs, and gpg package signing on BSD/RedHat/debian as another method that is transparent to the user, but will alert them if something is not right.)
Re:The Term 'App Store' is Becoming Over Used (Score:5, Funny)
Agreed. This seems to be more of an official non-classified download repository than anything else. If I were in a small business and called their samba share that had the install images of Office, Acrobat, and other licensed packages for internal use an "app store", I'd be looked at by their IT people like I was some troll or pirate.
A+++++++++++++++ commenter. Would read again!
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Agreed. This seems to be more of an official non-classified download repository than anything else. If I were in a small business and called their samba share that had the install images of Office, Acrobat, and other licensed packages for internal use an "app store", I'd be looked at by their IT people like I was some troll or pirate.
But the government isn't like a small business. It's like a very large business, and that sort of concept has been around for a while; we do the same thing for applications here with a secure webserver that employees (and students since we're a university) can download install images from, with appropriate invoices being generated internally if necessary afterwards (depends on what sort of license was negotiated with the vendor).
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If I were in a small business and called their samba share that had the install images of Office, Acrobat, and other licensed packages for internal use an "app store", I'd be looked at by their IT people like I was some troll or pirate.
Yes, but you'd be looked at by their management as though you were some kind of genius or saviour.
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I work for the FAA. We can't even (officially) get a browser more modern than IE6 unless you are a web developer. How a
Re:The Term 'App Store' is Becoming Over Used (Score:4, Funny)
They need lots of bullshit to fertilize their money trees.
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hmmm...that gives me some ideas...
"The Pirate Bay" is now an "App Store" running a Buy One, Get it Free sale. See, it's in business speak. That make it legal...
"Linux, Now with the YUM App Store!"
How is this going to help.. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:How is this going to help.. (Score:4, Insightful)
But it really is transparent as in you can't see it (mostly because its not there).
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Simple. Joe Biden signed up for an account at Mint.Com [mint.com]. Our financial problems are over!
(Serious aside: The Fed could/should employ a team of designers and information experts (a la Edward Tufte or this guy [wallstats.com]) to help improve the transparency and operational efficiency of the government. Mint.com has some great examples of boring/old data presented in a fresh, informative, and visually-attractive manner. There's plenty of scientific evidence showing that aesthetics can improve cognition. The Obama admini
Comment removed (Score:4, Informative)
Re:How is this going to help.. (Score:4, Interesting)
Are you certain? [youtube.com]
Re:How is this going to help.. (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm more worried about accountability. Any information posted or otherwise maintained on a private server is not subject to FOIA. It's protected by the 4th Amendment which is a much higher bar. This is the same as when Cheney used a private mail address for government business.
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There was a story (maybe in The Register) about how the Federation against Software Theft was going after large companies who weren't purchasing site licences. One large national company came after investigation. After months of paperwork auditing and tracking purchase receipts for individual licensed software distributions, FAST came to the conclusion that there was no piracy and that in fact there were more licenses than were actually used by the company.
The CIO and CFO than realized that there was a need
Need to audit an American? (Score:4, Funny)
There's an app for that.
Giovernment App Store? Cool! (Score:4, Funny)
Fantastic. An App Store puts democracy back into the hands of the ordinary citizen.
In fact, I think open an account right now, and buy myself a congressman.
'Nebula' cloud computing platform at NASA Ames (Score:2)
According to a comment over at NASA Watch, this is going to be at least conceptually based on the NEBULA cloud computing platform developed by NASA Ames. It seems pretty cool and potentially quite useful. Calling it an "app store" is a really dumb analogy though, and gives absolutely no idea of what it actually entails:
http://nebula.nasa.gov/ [nasa.gov]
http://www.nasawatch.com/archives/2009/09/ames_will_help.html [nasawatch.com]
I am the Project Coordinator for Nebula, the cloud computing pilot at NASA Ames. Nebula has been in R&D and under development for well over a year. There are many reasons that a large organization, such as NASA, would explore cloud. The Nebula team did an extensive trade study to see what public clouds out there could meet NASA's needs. None did. Either they were not fast and powerful enough to handle NASA's massive data sets or they did not comply with security requirements. NASA needed its own cloud. I won't go into technical specifics (you can read about them at http://nebula.nasa.gov/ [nasa.gov] but the Nebula team ended up creating something that is smart, powerful, and incredibly energy-efficient to boot.
NASA was approached by the Feds because Nebula solves some cloud problems that are common among other Government Agencies. It is wicked fast, complies with FISMA and can scale to Government-sized demands. It is also rather forward-thinking in that it is built using open-source components and is incredibly energy efficient. Again, Nebula was created with NASA - not the Feds - in mind, but when they caught wind, they were interested too.
I suggest that people spend some time reading about what is actually going on before they jump to conclusions. To my knowledge there have been no announcements that Ames will orchestrate the Fed's move to cloud computing or develop any new systems or technologies that were not already under development. NASA has been responsible for a number of innovative new technologies over the years. Memory foam, for example. NASA invented it, but are they out there selling mattresses? :) Some people seem so caught up in the politics that they have completely missed the point.
Posted by: Gretchen at September 16, 2009 8:42 PM
FOIA and "Transparency"? (Score:3, Interesting)
I don't know. I thought keeping data on old clunky servers is kind of necessary for purposes of the Freedom of Information Act and this whole "transparency" idea. They are going to start storing data in gmail and youtube accounts? Maybe I'm missing something, but this doesn't feel right.
FOIA - for the hosting companies! (Score:1)
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Apple's attorneys are going to be all over them (Score:3, Interesting)
However, it is possible to lose the rights to your trademark if it falls into common use. That's why so many companies defend their marks so vigorously.
new != good (Score:2)
And that's a bad thing?
It's not a government Internet. (Score:2)
YouTube, GMail, and Wordpress are not designed for official government business. What's more the technology of today is not made to facilitate people interacting with their government. Being created by commercial interests It's made to do two things:
Vivek Kundra is a fraud (Score:2)
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/08/12/special-report-is-us-chief-information-officer-cio-vivek-kundra-a-phony/ [dvorak.org]
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Please, Vivek, explain away:
Okay, that took 30 seconds with Google. Om Malik (a respected journalist not a notorious and admitted troll like Dvorak) looked into Dvorak's claims:
http://www.examiner.com/x-10080-DC-Technology-Examiner~y2009m8d12-Dvorak-alleges-US-CIO-and-exDC-chief-is-a-fake [examiner.com]
In short, for all the points he had an opportunity to verify it turned out Dvorak was wrong and it was clear Dvorak had not tried very hard to look into the matter since random bloggers were able to quickly find proof using public internet resources
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Here's the stuff that Vivek has yet to resolve, from Dvorak's article. And I think they are major issues. Hell, any honest person thinks
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Who's the troll?
Dvorak.
There are legitimate questions about the man...
Yup, questions and not answers. Questions like are you, Coolhand2120, a murderer. Asking that question without actually doing any research, when you're already a notorious troll, that's called trolling.
Legitimate journalists looked, and so far have decided there is no story. Maybe at some point in the future someone will decide Kundra's background actually is suspicious, but not finding info with a quick Google search is not evidence that he's lying. Just as quickly googling "Coolhand2020 innocent of
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Your claim that I am a murder was just made up, and I could actually sue you for libel in this country (USA), so you have proven yourself to be a complete jack ass. I never said "Hey I murdered someone", Vivek, on the other hand, did say he has a bio degree that seems to have vanished. And that's why Vivek can never sue
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Your claim that I am a murder was just made up, and I could actually sue you for libel in this country (USA), so you have proven yourself to be a complete jack ass.
I never claimed you were a murder. Can a person be a murder? I made reference to asking the question of if you're a murderer. I welcome your lawsuit. Good luck getting a lawyer. It's called an example, by the way, which demonstrates why the principal you propose is wrong.
I never said "Hey I murdered someone", Vivek, on the other hand, did say he has a bio degree that seems to have vanished.
Seems to have vanished? Or is Dvorak simply asking the question of if it vanished because he doesn't see it in any online resources?
Your problem is you believe it to be the responsibility of the person refuting the unsubstantiated claim to prove his case.
No, I believe when you've cried wolf many times and told people you cry wolf to drive advertising to your l
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Dvorak is basically saying, what has Vivek ever done that makes you think he has the stones to be the CTO for a Fortune 1000 company let alone the Federal Government?
No, he's not. He's saying he looked into Dvorak's bio and could not confirm from internet searches that all of it was true, then he implies we should assume it isn't. He does this to generate traffic to his blog as people debate it because that's how he makes money. He's stated more than once he intentionally tries to drive traffic to his sight by putting inflammatory opinions and opinions he knows are unsupportable because that draws in people to comment about how wrong he is.
"Visitor" to Apps.gov (Score:1)
Welfare for tech cronies (Score:2)
All this really is is welfare for all the tech cronies that supported the Obama campaign. Yahoo, Google, all were big Obama supporters, so much that even some righties wonder if right wing content is page ranked lower on Google. Now they get their share of the taxpayer trough.
Actual presentation at Youtube (Score:3, Informative)
I watched the presentation at NASA TV, it was given at NASA Ames Research Center.
They have archive of it at Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/profile?v=eND7hT8JdwA&user=NASAtelevision [youtube.com]
That is the guy presenting the idea himself. It was interesting enough to watch it at 4 AM my local time. The numbers guy gives, like the 20% of capacity used, everyone having their own data center, it may take $600.000 (yes, 600K) to setup a weblog in certain circumstances while it is free on blogger.com like services are amazing.
As listeners are full of govt. guys, guy repeated 4-5 times that secret/critical things won't be on cloud, outside USA etc. What matters is, they will be forcing very strict privacy and security rules to vendors.
The Fed CIO is a crook... (Score:1)
This has been done for DECADES (Score:4, Insightful)
People who are shaking at the knees about google and the federal government obviously are not aware that the government has been outsourcing data processing to offsite contractors for decades.
Sheesh. Google is no different than ANY other contractor when it comes to the Federal government and has to abide by the same contracting rules as everybody else.
Does this mean that it's any SAFER than at EDS, Booze Allen, Perot Systems, HP, IBM, etc? No. But it's not any less either.
Public-Private Partnerships vs. Corruption? (Score:1)
Kundra video: Cloud=Good, Datacenters=Bad! (Score:2)
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*blinks*
You're... comparing Barrak Obama to... Hitler?
Wow.
Why?
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Huh.
So - do you think Canada, Switzerland, France, Germany, Austria, Australia, and Britian, to name a few, are the equivalent to or worse than Hitler's Nazi Germany?
Personally, I think you're just ignorant of both recent and long-term history. Fortunatly, that can be cured by education, if you're willing to make the effort. You seem ignorant of both Nazi history, as well as the histories of nations in general, especially those called 'socialist' by those who don't know what the word means.
I understand that
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2. I never mentioned socialism or socialist nations.
3. I've been to almost all the nations you cite, none are like Nazi Germany and I have no problem with modern socialism.
4. The comments I made ARE verifiable and objective. Hitler and Obama were both "Men of the Year", they both support leftist, progressive, and fringe-science ideas and their fundamentals were/are rooted in fascism. Look it up.
The fact that you call me "ignorant" for typing a post
Re:The bigger question is... (Score:4, Informative)
This actually does sound a lot like what the Obama administration is doing with healthcare reform, the economy, and the auto industry to a limited extent.
Re:The bigger question is... (Score:5, Insightful)
I think the assumption that you're uneducated is a fair charge. I don't even know where to begin, except maybe to suggest you should read an actual history book, probably starting with the definition of important terms. Hitler's idea of a state was a genocidal, deeply racist, right-wing extremist, fascist junta presiding over a society run purely on hierarchical peer pressure, a state further corrupted and held in power by an overreaching military-industrial complex. It was the poster child of a surveilance state that really deserved the label "totalitarian".
If you absolutely must compare today's political ideologies with that you'd find that our contemporary right-wing parties are actually much closer to this than the left - but even Dick Cheney and Pat Robertson are not quite in the same leage as Hitler, and that's saying something. By the way, the actual socialists came in the time after Nazi Germany - so comparing Obama to Honnecker would probably make more sense for the charges you are making, which are incidentally also complete bullshit.
I'm sorry, I don't normally go for ad hominem attacks like this, but I'm a German (so please excuse my English) and I feel very strongly about people getting their facts right as opposed to the mindless parroting of hopelessly corrupt historical fiction.
I can't help but wonder: why didn't you people cry out when our civil liberties were taken away progressively in the time after 9/11? Now that was a lost opportunity, that was the last time when freedom was actually at stake. Not only did we lose that fight so thoroughly during the Bush administration, Obama is now actually legitimizing those changes. That would have been a fight worth our time. That would have been the moment to stand up for liberty. What did you do to prevent that? I sincerely hope you didn't just sit on your ass like I did.
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While comparing Obama to Hitler is inappropriate (Hitler openly called for genocide even before he was elected), Obama is closer on the political spectrum to Hitler than Bush or Cheney were/are. You seem to think that Hitler and Stalin were on o
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Ah, I see what the misunderstanding is, you got left and right confused. Anarchy is usually considered extreme left and absolute totalitarian regimes can be both, but are right if they are fascist and/or nationalistic. Since you won't believe me, allow me to cite Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] (I know, not an official source but it'll have to do for now):
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I find it interesting that I'm presenting a very simple and clear idea without attacking anyone, but I'm being attacked and called ignorant or uneducated. To me, that kind of communication is both ignorant and uneducated. I went to college, I got good grades, I also knew better than to believe everything my stoned, pseudo-liberal pr
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You are calling thasmudyen's post an attack? Seriously? That post was civil and informative. Actually, let me correct myself. It would be civil and informative for the Real World; it was amazingly civil and informative for the Internet. And he didn't call you uneducated or ignorant. You were using the terms incorrectly, and he gave you the correct meaning
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Hitler's idea of a state was a genocidal, deeply racist, right-wing extremist, fascist junta presiding over a society run purely on hierarchical peer pressure, a state further corrupted and held in power by an overreaching military-industrial complex. It was the poster child of a surveilance state that really deserved the label "totalitarian".
Did you read the whole thread? Sitarlo is not saying that Obama is the second coming of Hitler, he's pointing out political similarities. See "I don't think Obama is a evil person like Hitler obviously was, but they share startling political traits." Now, it's hard to reconcile that with his opening post declaring that Obama's administration is "bent on destroying the U.S." but the inflammatory statement doesn't nullify the valid comparison, which was further illuminated by this AC [slashdot.org].
If you absolutely must compare today's political ideologies with that you'd find that our contemporary right-wing parties are actually much closer to this than the left -
Oh, I don't know about
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Yeah, I read that, but not very carefully. I'm more focused on the policies at hand, and I wasn't responding to defend the guy. My entry point into the thread was reading the highly-rated AC comment I linked which actually did a good job of rationally outlining the issue of fascist and socialist policy. My reading of the rest of the thread was colored by that initial post, so I missed the import of that last statement.
And yet, everything else in my post--which in my mind is far more important--goes unack
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Look, I wasn't calling Obama a Nazi. That would be ridiculous. I was simply pointing out the possibility of fascist tendencies in current U.S. politics. That is all.
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When are U.S. citizens going to realize they voted in an administration bent on destroying the U.S.
Your post (Troll, -1) is well modded, and I shouldn't feed you but what the hell. I'm sure some neocon with mod points will mod me down, but I can take a downmod once in a while.
It was the previous administration hell bent on destroying the US, and they did a pretty damned good job of it, too. Under the previous administration we were attacked, despite the fact that there were dire warnings of Al Quaida from t
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no, the bigger question is:
Where are all the fart apps?
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